Hey folks! This week we’re doing Sparta. We know they’re warriors, but I want you to use your chosen reading to try to dig deeper. What’s important to the Spartans? What about their society did you not expect to find? Given that these authors were not Spartans themselves, how much of what we know about the Spartans do you think might be conditioned by the perceptions of others?

I chose the fifth and last reading from above on Aristotles writing of the Spartan constitution. I chose this reading for two reasons that being my own personal interest in learning about Sparta's governing and I had also chosen to present this topic. One moment from the text that stood out to me was when Aristotle blamed Spartan women for becoming lazy and greedy ending the Spartan way, just due to the way the information is presented it seems like a very strange aspect to focus on in relation to the constitution. I do also find another moment when he compares Spartan and Cretan constitution also interesting as I wouldn't have known they influenced Spartas. I believe that Aristotle was trying to both positively highlight the aspect of polity as well as certain frames and concepts built into it, but he also negatively highlights Spartas reliance on war and the spartan way for their lifestyle to continue. I believe the document is telling us that at this time various different types of governing were developing among the Greek city states. I believe that this document and the way it breaks down Sparta adds supporting information to certain aspects of Sparta pertaining specifically to war. This highlights Spartas fighting nature with a reliance on war for their society to properly run as they had no real economic standing. I would like to know more random and small facts about Sparta as I just find their society interesting.

The reading I selected was the Saying of Spartan Women. One theme that recurs throughout the entire text is that Spartan women find it honorable to raise children (sons) who are willing to go out and die for their country. They place tremendous pride in dying for Sparta, and anyone who is not willing to do so is not worthy of continuing to live. Many of these sayings include Spartan mothers celebrating and rejoicing, knowing that their sons died for their country and that they birthed and raised Spartan heroes. On the contrary, many of the sayings also show the utter disgust, anger, and shame that these same mothers felt at discovering that their sons ran from war; in some severe cases, the mother herself would kill that child because she considered it a shame to let the son who would die for Sparta to live. This document supports what we’ve learned about the Spartans because they carry a pride in their nation, even to the point where it affects them. After reading this, one thing I would like to find out more about is whether there were any of these sayings directed to the daughter of Sparta, not just the sons.

This week's response I chose Sayings of Spartan women because it was so captivating during the Spartan time. These women were so independent, in total charge of their households, and raised their male children to become fierce warriors. The male breeds in the family were admitted into the military academy at the age of seven years old to be trained, stand up bravely and fight relentlessly. They had to prove themselves out in battle to become honorable men.

“Come back with your shield - or on it” (Plutarch, Mor. 241) was supposed to be the parting cry of mothers to their sons. Mothers whose sons died in battle openly rejoiced; mothers whose sons survived hung their heads in shame. I disagreed with the way of life they had and taught. These men didn't have the right or a choice to make their own decisions at hand to be themselves. In my opinion, I wouldn't have made that choice against their will to make a voluntary choice to join the academy or not. Choices back in the Spartan time were arranged and chosen from when they were born.

Mother-son sayings express the deep, unbreakable, and lifelong bond between a mother and her son, highlighting love, pride, and guidance. Common themes include a mother's constant love, a son being the best part of a mother's life, and the unique nature of this relationship. Sayings often emphasize the son's growth into a wise, independent, and successful man, with a mother's support being crucial to his journey.

The writing I chose for this week was Herodotus’ “The Spartan Way of Living”. This excerpt features a dialogue between the Persian king, Xerxes, and Demaratus, a Spartan exile. Despite his bitterness toward Sparta, Demaratus speaks with reverence about the Spartan way of life, highlighting their values of courage, discipline, and loyalty to law. Herodotus uses this exchange to contrast the disciplined, freedom-based society of the Spartans with the autocratic, conscription-based Persian system.

Xerxes is portrayed as arrogant and dismissive of the power of free men, while the Spartans are shown as fiercely committed to battle, law, and honor even in the face of certain death. The Spartans, though technically free, live under strict military discipline and are governed by the law, which they are purported to respect more than anything else. They are trained from youth to be warriors and are forbidden to flee from battle, embodying the motto “to conquer or die.” Through this account of Spartan life, Herodotus elevates Greek, especially Spartan, values as morally and culturally superior to those of the Persians.

The reading I chose was The Spartan Way of Living by Herodotos because it provides an interesting perspective on the values and customs that made Sparta so unique in the ancient world. What caught my attention most was the dialogue between Xerxes, The Persian king, and Demaratus, a Spartan exile. Xerxes couldn't understand how the Greeks, especially the Spartans, would dare to resist the enormous Persian army. Demaratus explained that Spartans were bound by their strict laws and customs, which they feared and respected more than any ruler or enemy. This shows that their society was built on discipline, loyalty, and obedience to tradition. Herodotus seems to be highlighting the difference between Persia, ruled by an all-powerful king, and Sparta, which was governed by its laws. This disparity tells us that the Greeks valued law and civic duty as much as, or even more than, power and authority. For the Spartans, freedom came from submitting to their customs, which gave them the courage to face overwhelming odds in battle. The reading connects with Xenophon’s The Spartan Polity, which also emphasizes obedience, discipline, and collective responsibility. Yet, it also raises questions about whether Herodotus was portraying an idealized image of Sparta to inspire other Greeks. I would like to learn more about how ordinary Spartans lived under this system, and whether they truly embraced it as fully as their leaders claimed.

The reading I chose was the one about the Great Rhetra of Sparta. The reason I chose this reading was due to the fact that the Spartans weren't your typical civilization. Although they strove for unity and order, they used war out of all things to enforce it. So to say that I was interested in how a civilization that basically ran itself on war managed to govern itself would be an understatement. The detail that stood out to me while reading was when it stated how the assembly was divided into two groups, that being the phylai/obai and the gerousia. Now, to the average person, they'd think that it's a no-brainer that they'd have to separate themselves into groups, but that would be because they wouldn't know an aspect of Spartan culture. Spartan citizens saw themselves as equals, even for those who were over the age of 60. So for them to have themselves divided as such, either meant it was only that case in the saying, or certain conditions had to be met in order for that belief to be true. The only thing I could think of that the author was trying to communicate was that this rhetra was a foundation for how the Spartans would drive their future and how this could also be the beginning of a social issue within Spartan society. In my opinion, this document is telling us that it comes from a time when Sparta was still growing a civilization and needed rules to be governed by, or that Spartan society had gotten to a point where they needed to be governed by rules set in place. This document seems to relate to other readings in terms of the mentality the Spartans had about themselves. What I would like to know more about is if there was any attempt to humble themselves, seeing as they believed they had achieved arete.

The article I chose this week is The Spartan Way of Living because I was interested in reading about the Spartan way of living from their own perspective. The part of the article that stood out the most to me is when Demarcus replied to Xerxes, “ First then, no matter what, the Spartans will never accept your terms. This would reduce Greece to slavery. They are sure to join battle with you even if all the rest of the Greeks surrendered to you. As for Spartan numbers, do not ask how many or few they are, hoping for them to surrender. For if a thousand of them should take the field, they will meet you in battle, and so will any other number, whether it is less than this, or more.” This part stood out to me because it emphasizes the way of life and upbringing of the Spartans, born and raised for battle. I think Herodotus was trying to highlight how different the way of life of the Spartans is from other societies and political systems and how loyal the Spartans were to their way of life. This document is demonstrating a very unique approach to life and law in which the citizens are extremely loyal to the law and not a ruler or King. This document supports other readings about Ancient Greece that prove how unique Greek societies were in their way of life, structure, law, loyalty, and courage. I would like to know more about the Greek citizens, what motivated them to be so loyal to their law that they would not back down from battle even when they are outnumbered, what made them so fearless and united in this way, is it cultural values or their life philosophy?

The reading I chose was: The Spartan Polity. I basically chose it because it's always fascinating to see how cities are organized and how that affects their citizens. For example, how their social infrastructure was basically designed to create a perfect community of warriors, like a social experiment.

The detail that most caught my attention was the part about food. It shocked me that the system encouraged young people to steal food to relieve their hunger, but if they were caught, they were punished not for stealing, but for being clumsy enough to get caught. This shows that Spartan society valued cunning and skill more than honesty itself. In my opinion, this was also a very harsh way to prepare them for war.

I think the author, who at the beginning seems to express astonishment, was trying to communicate that Sparta's power didn't happen by magic or by accident. Instead, its strength and prestige came directly from these very strict and unconventional laws and customs they had. I believe his message was that by removing luxuries, comfort, and family life, and replacing them with brutal training and total loyalty to the state, Lycurgos managed to create a society as powerful as Sparta.

This document tells us that the city-state of Sparta was an extremely militarized and disciplined place. Its culture valued obedience, resistance to pain, and public humiliation for cowards above all else. Because of this, the well-being of the state was more important than the comfort or even the family of the individual themselves. In other words, it paints a picture of a place where personal freedom was completely sacrificed in the name of the common or collective strength.

Well, for example, I compared this reading with the city of Athens, which is where most of our other readings usually come from. Because while Athens is famous for philosophy, art, and democracy, Sparta is like its opposite: a militarized society focused on the obedience and austerity of its citizens. There's no talk of poets, philosophers, or artists, only of soldiers.

After reading this, well, I would like to know more about the lives of women in Sparta. The text briefly mentions that the young men were even more sober than the women, which implies that Spartan women also had a reputation for being, I don't know, serious. I'm not sure where I heard or read it, but I learned that women in Sparta had more freedoms and received physical training, and so I would like to learn more about their daily lives, their education, and what role they really played in their society.

I picked Sayings of Spartan Women. I was curious about the reputation and expectations of women living in a patriarchal society. As I read the passage, what caught my attention was the women in that time who were proud to lose their sons if their death ended in victory. If their son's death did not end in victory, they resort to killing their own son or deny their affiliation with their son. I think the author was sharing the emphasis of the concern of the woman’s reputation over the well being of the sons they bore. I think this document gives us a peek into the culture of Sparta. The woman’s pride was in the victory of their son. This was a culture of domination and war. The women's power came from the identity of their sons ability to be strong and keep up the integrity of what Sparta stood for. I think this reading supports the reading The Spartan Way of living. When asked by King Xerxes if Demaratus thought the Greeks would really fight against them, Demaratus' answer confirms the Spartans desire to fight and win. He says that although the Spartans are free men, their seriousness and obedience to the law and commitment to war. This supports the reading of the Sayings of Spartan Women. Some of the women who heard of their son's death were more concerned about their victory in the war and not the death itself. Demaratus goes on to say if he had to fight, he would rather fight those who think they are a match for any three Greeks than to fight Sparta. His statement displayed confidence in the Spartan’s strength and determination and ruthlessness to win battles.

For this week’s discussion response I selected Herodotos on The Spartan Way of Living. This caught my attention due to my personal curiosity, as well as my prior knowledge on a few aspects around the Spartan way of life from previous texts and other resources over the years. The dialogue presented from Herodotos on Demaratos and Xerxes did not only solidify the tension between these existing nations, but also emanated the ‘glory’ of the Spartan. I believe this was Herodots’ main focus, to bring to the reader’s attention that Spartans were not just a pivotal part of Grecian history, but they carried with them a unique ‘spirit’ that embodied their entire livelihood and the principles which established Sparta as a “people ruled by laws.”

Throughout the reading Herodotos uses wonderful expressions that truly define what it means to be a Spartan, not just a Greek. To state, “All Greeks are brave, but what I am about to say does not concern all, but only the Spartans.”  Even further, the statement by Demaratos, “...no matter what, the Spartans will never accept your terms.” What a strong resolve against a mighty enemy, and outnumbered. However, it is significant to note that Herodotos embellishes not just the physical bravery of the Spartan, but also the laws that govern them. It was not just a sense of pride, but of integrity that carried the Spartan to the ‘victory’ that they wanted to achieve and maintain. I would enjoy learning more about the specifics of why the ‘Spartan Way’—the main principles that guided them, did not outlast (as it seems), their own people. 

For me, what really made The Spartan Way of Living interesting was how different the life of a Spartan is from modern-day life. The conception of a society so heavily influenced by discipline, obedience, and military excellence is not only interesting but also extreme; it made me think about the cultural priorities of a people and how far they are willing to go to maintain and uphold those values. One detail that stuck out was how Spartan boys were taken from families at age seven to begin military training under the agoge. The harshness of their upbringing—being taught to endure pain, hunger, and punishment without complaint—only accentuated how serious the Spartans were about shaping their citizens into warriors. The notion of being encouraged to steal food (as long as getting caught wasn’t an option) was also a standout because it highlights an intriguing form of morality centered on cunning and survival rather than honesty. The lifestyle of Sparta can be seen as perhaps the most unique and even admirable in its devotion to discipline and strength. At the same time, by comparing them with other city-states, he probably also points out how radical and possibly inhuman the system they had was. He is not praising or condemning them. He is writing about how they produced the fabulous military reputation they had. There is in Herodotus, it appears, a kind of item, which denotes the measure that the Spartan life was perhaps the most unique and even befitting in all its devotion to discipline and strength. At the same time, maybe by comparing with other Greek city-states, he points out how radical and even inhuman their system was. Neither is he praising nor condemning. He's putting on paper how customs form that legendary military reputation. This document illustrates how diverse the ancient Greek city-states were in values and practices, as Sparta really differed from Athens in this aspect. While Athens celebrated philosophy and expression through art and democracy, Sparta concentrated almost entirely on war, obedience, and the collective versus the individual. It was a time when survival, power, and dominance were inseparable from military might. This document also shows how Greek historians like Herodotus were interested in capturing the contrasts between cultures. The document agrees with what we know about ancient Sparta: that it was a militarized society with firmly established roles and expectations for men and women alike. It also supports the larger theme of divergence in ancient Greece, wherein even within a single civilization, lifestyles could vary quite drastically. Some of the things he says, however, can sometimes be exaggerated or idealized, since Herodotus relies on vague hearsay and storytelling rather than actual historical evidence. This means that while, in some respects, it forwards the values of the time, it may reflect how certain people wanted to view Sparta as a bastion of strength and toughness.

The reading I chose was “The Spartan Way of Living”, written by Herodotos and the reason why I chose this reading was just being curious at seeing how they describe their way of living. Demaratos mentioned a curious take on what Spartan liberty meant. Though considered free people, he insisted Spartans weren’t wholly so, instead, they embraced law as something to which they submitted. This master's command is absolute and unchangeable: "It forbids them to flee in battle, whatever the number of their foes. He requires them to stand firm-to conquer or die". Herodotos wanted readers to grasp how different life felt under a king who demanded everything versus a community guided by shared rules. Through conversation, he illustrated Persia, embodied by Xerxes, gaining control via sheer force alongside intimidation. However, Sparta, standing for what Greeks valued, found power in people freely choosing to uphold ‘good order,’ which Herodotos called eunomia. This was written around 440 BCE, and it shows how crucial laws were to the Greeks, really, the bedrock of their whole way of life, shaping who they believed themselves to be. They strongly set themselves apart from outsiders (“barbarians”), seeing their fight against Persia as liberty versus tyranny. Moreover, it demonstrates just how famed Sparta’s strictness and fearless spirit, a willingness to either win or perish, were across Greece. What I would like to find out more about is what consequences would come when you try to oppose this, would you become a slave or just be banished from Sparta.?

Hey everyone! This week I decided to read Plutarch’s Sayings of Spartan Women. I picked it because it felt different—most of what we usually hear about Sparta is all about the warriors and their battles, but this text actually highlights the women’s voices and the values they carried.

The part that really stuck with me was when the women told their sons or husbands to come back from battle either “with their shield or on it.” That line hit hard because it shows just how much courage and loyalty to Sparta mattered, even more than surviving. What’s interesting is that it makes the women look like active enforcers of these ideals—they weren’t just in the background but were shaping how Spartan men thought about honor and duty.

It tells me that Spartan culture put loyalty to the state above everything else. What surprised me most, though, was how much influence the women seemed to have. I honestly didn’t expect them to play such a big role in pushing those values in what we usually think of as a male-centered society.

When I compare this to the other readings, it lines up with the whole idea that Sparta’s entire system was built around producing warriors and discipline. But this reading added another layer—it wasn’t just laws or training that kept that system running, it was also families and social pressure, especially from women.

One thing I’d like to know more about is how much of this is Plutarch’s own perspective versus what Spartan women were actually like. Since none of these writers were Spartans themselves, I wonder if some of this is exaggerated or maybe even idealized. Still, I found it fascinating how outsiders described Spartan women as tough, bold, and uncompromising.

I picked Plutarch’s Great Rhetra of Sparta because it shows how the Spartans believed their laws came from the gods, through the oracle at Delphi. What caught my attention was how the assemblies were held outside between a bridge and a river. Plutarch explains this was done so people wouldn’t be distracted by art or buildings, which shows how much Spartans valued simplicity and focus. I also noticed that while the people had a say, their choices could still be overturned by the kings and elders if they thought the decision was bad.

This tells us that Spartan society cared more about order and control than full democracy. It surprised me that the people’s power was so limited, compared to what we learn about Athens. At the same time, it matches the Spartan image of discipline and obedience to authority. Since Plutarch wasn’t a Spartan himself, I wonder how much of this account shows his own perspective instead of what Spartans really thought. I’d like to know more about how ordinary Spartans felt about being part of this system.