Hey folks! As we get into Clouds, what moments are coming across as strange or interesting? What’s the play telling you about the author’s take on the problems of Athens?

One part of Clouds that really stood out to me in Sections 3 and 4 was when Socrates explains his strange “Thinkery” and starts teaching Strepsiades about how to make the weaker argument seem stronger. It struck me as funny but also kind of disturbing because it shows how easily people can twist logic for selfish reasons. I think Aristophanes was trying to criticize how intellectual life in Athens had become disconnected from common sense and morality. He seems worried that people were using clever arguments just to win debates instead of actually seeking truth. I would like to learn more about how Athenian audiences at the time reacted to this and whether they saw it as just comedy or as a serious warning about what was happening in their city.

I think the more we learn about “Socrates” the more Aristophanes bias shines through. We continuously see Socrates do foolish things in the name of the thinkers while believing that what he is doing is correct and better. However, a lot of his actions contradict with the actual Socrates behaviors and what he believes. I find it strange how Aristophanes was able to defame Socrates in this way without realizing that he was doing the same thing he accused the sophists of. Aristophanes saw people like Socrates as deceivers that aim to lead the youth away from their culture and tradition; The more we read the more Aristophanes comes across as hypocritical to me.

Through this part I felt like the was pheidippides treated his father was mess up as he used Socrates teaching that he learned from his father for selfish reasons and felt like he should be justified for all his bad behaviors. By him using the reasoning of argument he succeeded in beating his father and showing the corruption of the teaching to harm others and distrub the norms of their society. The author is showing how certain teachings can be used for evil purposes and one as valuable as Socrates use of false speech has his cracks as well. Im hoping by the next chapter we can see the son get some type of backlash for using this method for his own gains

One moment that I found strange was the manner in which Socrates considered it normal to have Strepsiades lay in a flea infested bed and blanket to think out his troubles. Although Strepsiades was reluctant to follow Socrates’ instruction, he complied. It made me wonder what inspired Socrates to come up with this idea and why did he reason this to be effective in the context of the play. I believe the play is communicating Aristophanes’ take on the problems of Athens by portraying Socrates’ influence with his ideals.The play follows the character of Socrates in an exaggerated and unrealistic sense, and his actions and speech also follow this as shown in the sections thus far. Strepsiades, a citizen of Athens is being influenced by Socrates to leave behind his old way of thinking including his reverence to the gods and taking up a new form of thinking. Strepsiades represents the typical Athenian, who would adapt this new perspective to gain knowledge and would in turn sacrifice their traditional manner of thinking, leaving behind an essential part of their cultural identity. Aristophanes opposed this exchange and as he favored tradition, he stood strongly against any threats that would affect the traditions and culture of Athens. Among those threats was Socrates, who in the play appears to be completely out of reason in his manner of being. 

I was slightly surprised with how Pheidippides accepted his father's proposal to attend the Thinkery after his initial refusal. He was still against the ideas his Father preached to him as he saw it as unusual and maybe even blasphemous. I also think that Strepsiades willingly accepted Socrates' explanations even if it was wrong or right because he saw him as a genius. I think the author wanted to display Socrates' power with his words and his influence he can have on anyone that was willing to listen. The author has successfully used Socrates' character as a way to attack Athenian traditionalism with his disregard of religion seeing that he relies mainly on his opinions or his mind (Thinkery). Athenian problems may have been the newer generations lack of respect for the cultural/religious values from the past.

The moment that stood out to me is Socrates in a basket hanging in the air this was interesting to me because it just seems so out of place for the time. I believe the author was trying to create a narrative that Socrates was ridiculous in order to back up Aristophanes generalization of philosopher. I would like to find out whether or not Socrates was actually this silly or is this simply just for comedic purposes.

In section 3 of Clouds, one detail that stood out was Socrates just laying in a basket just so he can recollect his thoughts and to think better was interesting as it's pretty funny but also mean at the same time. It's really made me curious to if Socrates can get in trouble due to what he did

In the middle of Clouds, Aristophanes paints Socrates as a ridiculous, out of touch sophist a creator of words who lives in the clouds and teaches smart but dangerous arguments. He’s shown as someone who values cleverness over morals, corrupts young minds with crazy reasonings, and weakens traditional values, so Aristophanes seems to view figures like Socrates as both comic and socially harmful.

One detail that stood out to me, from Section 3, was Socrates denying Strepsiades’s belief of Zeus. Socrates is an avid disbeliever of the gods, where he explains away all of the phenomena Strepsiades attributes to Zeus as simply laws of physics. Despite not believing in gods, however, Socrates speaks of the laws of physics and the clouds in reverence, as if he was worshipping them like any one else with their gods. I think the author is trying to portray people like “Socrates” as hypocrites who will actively handwave gods, but deify material or nonsensical things like clouds. I wonder if Strepsiades will be forced to convert to the sophists worship of clouds as he learns more from them.

In Section 3 of Clouds, what jumped out to me was how Socrates teaches Strepsiades to use clever arguments to avoid paying his debts. It was surprising because Aristophanes makes Socrates seem like someone who twists logic for personal gain, unlike the wise philosopher we usually hear about. I think Aristophanes was criticizing how new thinkers could undermine traditional values and encourage dishonesty. I’d like to learn more about how Athenians really viewed Socrates—was this just satire, or did people take it seriously?

One detail that reached out to me was how Socrates was treated as a teacher and a free thinker. Socrates and Strepsiades often clashed over the reality of Zeus because Strepsiades follows old fashion morals of the gods controlling the narrative while Socrates is trying to change the narrative by finding new ideas to speak truth. It's interesting to see this side of Socrates because his moral code clashes with the status quo and results in him being an outcast. This could potentially be what the author intended by showing this new perspective of Socrates as a misguided soul with his head in the Clouds while the rest of Athens is living down to earth. I would to find out more about if Socrates will take more drastic measures to showcase his beliefs and if it results in his exile.